Says, religion behind northern govs’ motives
In this interview with FRED ITUA, the Secretary General of Christian Association of Nigeria (CAN), Dr Musa Asake, says, in spite of the clamour for a president of northern extraction in 2015, Christians of that enclave “are solidly behind Jonathan.” He also took a swipe at Mallam Nasir el-Rufai for his recent utterances, maintaining that with the manner the former FCT minister has been approaching affairs of state, “I think psychiatrists should examine” him.The CAN scribe, among other issues, also described some of northern governors’ actions as religiously motivated. Excerpts:
Former FCT minister, Mallam Nasir el-Rufai in a recent interview, referred to the Christian Association of Nigeria (CAN) as the mouthpiece of the ruling Peoples Democratic Party (PDP), how did the statement come to you?
I take his utterance as an insult. For him to take our leader and associate him with a political party is s total disrespect. It is not just an insult to our leader; it is also an insult to the Christian community in Nigeria. We cannot do that to the Muslims. I think psychiatrists should examine el-Rufai. The way he has been talking of recent is worrisome. I think he must tender an apology to the Christian body and our president, Pastor Ayo Oritsejafor in particular. We know that the PDP has its own spokesman. How then will el-Rufai say that? That is total disrespect. A true Muslim knows that he cannot just disrespect a religious leader like that. Enough is enough. He’s been saying a lot of things and we can no longer tolerate that.
The same el-Rufai allegedly tweeted some derogatory things about Jesus Christ some months back…
We responded to him then and also told him to shut his mouth. If it was a Christian that said something like that about Islam, this country would have gone up in flames. That tweet was deliberate. The man is so arrogant and opens his mouth wide.
The president of CAN, Oritsejafor revealed sometime last year that the Christian body would take Boko Haram to the International Criminal Court (ICC). We’ve not heard anything about it since then. What is the position of CAN right now on this?
As at the time our leader, Oritsejafor made that statement, you would agree that things were really bad in the country. We were helpless then because nobody was listening to us. But when the Federal Government went ahead and proscribed them, things became different. We’ve not abandoned the plan to take the case to ICC. We have to study the whole situation. The Federal Government has done a lot, even by declaring a state of emergency. We are both living witnesses to the fact that the killings have reduced. So, we are warning. We are supporting what the Federal Government is doing right now. We support them. Christians are not being killed anymore the way they used to kill them. We’ve not dropped the idea. We are praying for the security agencies.
The atrocities committed by the sect for which CAN wanted to take it to ICC are still there. Does that mean CAN is now going to overlook all that since there is a planned amnesty for the sect?
I am not saying that the atrocities will be overlooked. People are still being killed. If you look at it the way it was, things have slowed down. That was why I said we were watching. Our lawyers are studying the situation.
The president of CAN has openly declared that the proposed amnesty programme for Boko Haram members will fail. Judging by what you’ve said, does CAN still maintain that stand?
CAN has been very consistent since the Federal Government came up with that word, amnesty. We said ‘no’ from the very beginning. We said you cannot give amnesty to somebody you don’t know. Let them come out. We’ve never supported amnesty because you cannot give amnesty to people you don’t know. That was why when the committee on dialogue invited CAN, we said we were not going to talk to them. There were two reasons for that. The committee was given 90 days and it invited CAN towards the last week of its sitting. We felt it was an after-thought. If you look at the combination of the committee, out of over 20, only seven of them are Christians. We felt there will be no justice. So, for us to go and sit down and begin to talk to a committee that had already finished its work, was not fair. We Christians are the people who are being killed and whose churches are being destroyed. We didn’t understand. CAN has never considered amnesty at all.
The recent move by the Borno State government to demolish over 20 churches in the state has been described by many religious leaders as a ploy to islamise the region and possibly the country, by shutting down churches. What is CAN doing about that?
Everybody is entitled to his own opinion. In our office, we have a letter from the Ministry of Lands and Survey, Borno State. In that letter, they wrote, using the authority of the governor that they were going to remove the people living in that area. When we checked, we discovered that there are many churches there. These churches have about 600 acres of land. They have a school. That has a concern. They said they want to build a housing estate. These people they want to evict are fully settled. They were given the place a long time ago. For the state government just to come around and say that they want to demolish the churches, that raises some concern. We are not talking about islamisation. We are talking about fairness. There are 20 churches there. I can even give you the names of churches in that area.
The fear that the moves are geared towards clamping down on Christians or islamising the country does not arise, then?
You know everything happening in Nigeria is something else. The fear is always there. In Kano State, when Shekarau was governor, there was a very large ECWA church. He said he wanted to build a hospital and without consulting anybody, he destroyed that church. He denied Christians their place of worship. What has been done to that place since he left office? So, when I hear these northern governors say whatever they’re are saying, religion is behind it.
There is this agitation by some northern leaders that the region will not support President Goodluck Jonathan’s bid for 2015. If you say northern leaders have mixed politics with religion, are northern Christians also against that bid?
In as much as I don’t want to delve into political issues, as a Nigerian and a northerner, you’re including me. Therefore, I will respond to that. When you talk of northerners not supporting Jonathan in 2015, my question is, who are those northerners? Let them say Muslims will not support Jonathan. If they say that, it will be better for us to understand. In 2011, they didn’t support Jonathan and I don’t see them supporting him in 2015. Christians are solidly behind Jonathan. There may be some pockets of Christians here and there. Everybody has the right to his own opinion when it comes to politics.
Many people believe President Jonathan has revived the Almajiri system of education in the North. He’s believed to be doing other things. Are these things not sufficient to earn him support of core North?
I don’t think so. They got what they wanted. Schools were built by churches 40 years ago. They were taken over by the government. At that time under the supervision of a Christian minority, General Yakubu Gowon, these schools were built. Forty years later, under the supervision of another Christian president who is from the minority, brought back the almajiri education which is strictly a Koranic school. They got whatever they wanted. We Christians will continue to pray and trust God. Let me make a point clear here. I’ve watched and read about the governor of Anambra State, Peter Obi who returned schools to their original owners. He has done so well. May God bless that man. He’s even given money to sustain those schools while others are busy doing other things. I want to say publicly that he’s done that which is pleasant to Nigerians.
You recall that many Christians were victims of post-election violence in 2011. Many people still harbour the fear that unless something urgent is done, we might see a recurrence of that. Do you harbour such fears?
The crisis in 2011 didn’t take anybody by surprise, because General Muhammadu Buhari who was running at that time assured us that if he didn’t win, he would make the nation ungovernable. Nobody did anything to him. When he didn’t win, churches were set ablaze. Nobody will say we were taken unawares. We were warned, only that our security agencies didn’t do anything. For 2015, nobody has said he will make governance very difficult. I pray nobody comes out to say that. Nigerians are what they are. We Christians are praying that we have peaceful elections. We will respect whoever comes to rule. That is our mandate from the Holy Bible. I’m very hopeful.
Clergymen in Nigeria appear to have taken the backseat in decision-making. Christians are worried by this trend. Are you bothered?
I don’t think Christians have taken a backseat. It is one thing to advise and it is another thing for the person to take it. A piece of advice is not a law. If, as Christians, we advise the government and they don’t listen to us, what do we do? We then pray for them. That is what we are doing. In Nigeria, there are Christians that are playing good roles and are getting involved in the running of this country. There are some areas where Christians have compromised. For that, we cannot pretend. We wish things were better.
Don’t you think Christian leaders should speak up more often when things are not going right? Like the case of ASUU’s ongoing strike?
Some Christian leaders are speaking. Journalists always turn our words and put them the other way round. When we don’t talk, you people are the first to say we are not talking. I think Christian leaders have spoken on this issue. There is a level to which you can go. Some people are there who don’t want these things to happen. If we actually value education, I don’t see the reason government will enter into an agreement with ASUU and not honour it. I don’t know what the government takes the education to be. What do you want the Christian leaders to say? We are praying that God touches them. Christian leaders are limited because we didn’t put them in those positions. If the church had put them there, we can recall them. When you wake up and find your own way, there is nothing we can do. When you have a programme and you invite them, they don’t come, until they know they need you. If you’ve been following us, our president has always reacted to every major issue that has come up. We are all Nigerians and must speak against the ills of this country.
About 70-80 per cent of the private universities in Nigeria are owned by churches and Christian leaders. Many people believe because Christian leaders have their schools, they don’t care if the public institutions are doing well..
When you say churches and Christian leaders own 80 per cent of the private universities, how did we get to this level? Churches had their own schools and everything went on fine. Many people in key positions attended Christians schools. When government took over those schools, everything became a mess.
When churches that can afford it decide to start their own while government is messing up their own, what do you want the churches to say? The church can only speak. We’ve been speaking.
The schools established by these churches are out of the reach of their own members. Is that not an irony?
You’re speaking as if you’re not a Nigerian. Which school is affordable in Nigeria? Let me take you to the public school in my village. They don’t have chairs. Children are sitting on the floor. When you start a private school, you need to equip it. There is no grant from anybody. So, where will you get the money from? When you apply to study in a public university, you’re not sure when you’ll graduate. We are at a point where we are not blaming anybody for what is happening. The leadership should have a rethink when it comes to education.
Imagine a situation where we don’t have these private schools in Nigeria? Look at our graduates and the way they run round the streets. There are no jobs. I think the government should thank the church.
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